SC telecon 28-09-2021

Present: Paolo, Francesco, Erminia, Eiichiro, Ludo, Peter, Gao, Enrique

Apologies: Jon, Matthieu

– Updates: 

            – Detector studies, if any news

            – Final version of PO document for site

            – Spanish CDTI grant 

– New LB members

– SGS taskforce (if any news)

– Planning of meetings (including S2S, PO, …)


– Choose a notetaker for the day

– Approval of minutes of last telecon

Approved 7 Sept. 14 Sept will be approved next time.

– Detector studies, if any news

UK (Peter/Gao): No significant update. Stafford writing documentation.

Francesco: preparing matrix with all tasks to do. Synthetic compendium of activities that we believe are to be done. Delivery of documentation expected by end of the year.

Paolo: same matrix as UK? FP: almost, reconstructed from memory/notes, since never got the actual matrix from Statford.

Brief interaction would be useful between Ital and UK, in particular w/ Statford. Peter will try to arrange this. Gao agrees since Oct 6 meeting is organized by ESA. Coordination is important. A/I on Pete for this.

Francesco: ESA never committed in supporting the mission but they are interested in supporting technological development.

Ludo: Goal of meeting is to present results to Thierry and PO. Global managing is still under CNES responsibility and the choice between various options needs to be managed by/ together with CNES.

Erminia: Who will choose between Italian and UK recipes? How will they come to terms?

Ludo: UK and Italian solutions are different. They have different impact.

Paolo: Thierry to send PO document. Promised by end of week.

Enrique on CDTI: PO asked for two Spanish positions subsystem level. Spain a proposal to Ludo and Thierry. Shared between IFCA and IAC. P. Casas and José Javier Díaz García

(not yet a member of LB). EMG would like to understand the difference between system architects and project manager. Name: housekeeping electronics. Spain also wants to cover thermometers, harness and control. Ludo: Control is assigned to thermal architect. Spain will contribute. For the other points we need to understand. ENG wants to know when the PO meets. Not on LB calendar. Proposal: P. Casas will be system architect. Xavier will take the other role. Need to discuss in more detail.

New members: José Javier Díaz García is approved by the SC. There is no need to request an opinion to conveners because he will join the PO in a well specified role. It is known that Thierry strongly supports this. Paolo will send his proposal to the LiteBIRD MB.

Global telecon: EMG to provide info about CDTI grant. Update about det studies and 2K ADR. Pete: say that we nearly done with the study. We can say that no show stopper. Peter to prepare one slide to provide updates without providing the outcome. However, the telecon may be postponed in view of the S2S in two weeks. Ludo will talk to Masashi about this.

No OB.

SC telecon 2019/08/22


+ ESA meeting of Oct 14 (discussed last time but no particpant was on)

+ Anything to discuss for Munich F2F?

– Any news from CNES?

– Updates on Costing?

– Performance team (action on Ludo to define charge)

– Updates on IMO, DM and JSG

– Public page to advertise LB on European site.


Present: Paolo, Francesco, Eiichiro, Giampaolo, Ludo, Erminia, Ingunn

Paolo, Eiichiro, Erminia, Giampaolo, Fracesco, Ludo, Enrique, Ingunn

ESA meeting of Oct 14 (discussed last time but no particpant was on)

CNES not present. Nor Fabio or Fredreric Safa. Really a pity. Not very useful. Nice opportunity to get exchange of ideas to Martin Linder. Passed messages. Task sharing diagram transmitted. Basis of discussion for future. Good that kink with Anjamaria and Martin is active. Anechoic cryogenic chamber at ESA. Designed for future experiment (Juice will be first). Good candidate for LiteBIRD.

Separate issue from CSL. Either we go to CSL or ESA. We don’t go both. We could still go to CSL for something else, not anechoic cryogenic calibration. The facility should be ready by 2021 at 4 K version. By next year 80 K version should be year for Juice. Only near field measurement, so they have machinery to reconstruct the far field from near field.


Proposal for ESA contributing to optical measurement. Peter De Maart not happy about refractive solution. Possible to re-open the baseline. Not immediate goal. Try to understand the limitation.


Point of costing addressed. Work in progress. Not distributed to ESA. Martin Linde OK with this. We understood that 50 million is strong cost cap for single mission of opportunity, not shared for more mission. But historically 20 has been the maximum allowed. Unlikely however to fund above 20 million, but it is case by case point.


How to involve UKSA. They need to know if UKSA can commit. Once CNES has decided to commit ESA could join the mission of opportunity. UKSA could then decide to join.


CNes leads MoO…

CNES internal review on the 7th of October. Long silence. Finally met the director of orbital system dpt at CNES. Pascal Danto was not allowed to say anything. CNES will decide in the coming weeks. Technical recommendation spelled out in the Oct 7th meeting. Non-blocking to commitment. Revieweing involvement at national level. Will have to make a choice and want to know if the mission is scientifically supported at the level of the French community.

F2F meeting.

Costing need to make exercise. ESA does not care about costing as long as space agency cover it. Ludo wants to keep costing exercise alive.  Data center box to be clarified.

SC telecon 09/03/2019

Meeting of LiteBIRD European Steering Committee — 03/09/2019 @ 12:00 on zoom


  1. Plans for Meetings:
    +Hands-on European Meeting in Santander 30/09 -> 02/10: draft agenda awaited
    + ESA Meeting of Oct 14. See mail fwd by Ludo. Clarify attendance
    + E-CMB meeting in Paris: talk(s) on LB, or possibly touching LB 
    + Others?
  2. Status of costing exercise throughout countries
  3. New SC members: Finnish proposal from E. Keihanen (see email fwd by Paolo). 
  4. Updates on IMO (including Maurizio’s role), DM and JSG activities
  5. Public page to advertise LB on European site.
  6. AOB


Present: Paolo Natoli (chair), Francesco Piacentini, Enrique Martinez Gonzalez, Jon Gudmundsson, Ludovic Montier, Radek Stompor

Apologies: Erminia Calabrese, Eiichiro Komatsu

Notes taken by FP, reviewed by PN


1. Action EMG: prepare a small text for logistic. Meeting structure:Monday Start at 10:30 with plenary. Parallel afternoon Tuesday: Parallel Wednesday: Plenary in the morning. No need of mac address: eduroam+20 accounts for the rest of people Action on Ludo: Draft an agenda on google sheet Splinter: we can suggest splinters but we need to put responsible people for the organization. Paolo with Giordano’s help opens the page on litebird-europe, with registration. Ludo then sends the announcement

ESA meeting on Oct. 14. Email from A, Stankov. Costing: is not upfront in the email. Ludo: discussion with Stankov. She mentioned they have an estimate of the total envelope: typically 25 Meuro. We will probably learn more at the meeting. She asked to prepare the work with all LB collaboration, including costing. We need to present a proposal of the task sharing. Ludo has a cost estimate from CNES, but they do not want to share it at the moment. This might change soon. Two figures:

  • Full cost of MHFT
  • Cost for CNES
We will know what JAXA will ask ESA. First estimate (we have some details from Masashi, Tadayasu) Esa meeting Attendance:  Not well defined yet. 
Need technical people in the afternoon. 
Representative from EU members (SC) + more technical people. 
Ludo proposes Baptiste to attend
(In CDF it was 15/20 people)
HWP: mechanism -> Paolo dB; ESA wants to be sure someone is taking care of that. 
AIT AIV Calibration people. Identified as a weak point at the CDF: Sophie and Marco
Nicola, if interested. As ASI point of contact. 
Electronics: under Canadian responsibility, with contribution from INFN. Not discussed at the CDF, Giovanni was attending more discussion then. We can consider him as a participant. Also responsible for DPU costing exercise.
DPU: not clear if ASI what to fund it. Better if we discuss internally first. 
Pisano: filters, optics, HWP
Experts: Bapriste, Paolo dB, Nicola, Sophie and Marco, (Giovanni)
A representative of the SC: 
We should have a splinter in Santander for the preparation of the ESA meeting. 
Ludo to ask A. Stankov, if someone from Jaxa or Masashi is needed. 
E-CMB meeting in Paris. Ludo to talk in Paris.  He will share slides. 
Paolo will talk on european simulation facilities. Mention Litebird network. In touch with Matthieu (telecon tonight)

No other meeting to discuss.

2. Costing exercise.

Italy: HWP mechanism: by beginning of October Calibration: news next week from Marco. DPU: available

France: No access to CNES estimates yet.
CNES review on Oct/7 (internal).
Ludo on CNES cost cup:
New negotiation in phase-A. The cost cap may change. Ludo feels that the CNES budget can rise if the situation is positive.
UK: Cardiff cost??? Very important for ESA meeting, Typically 50% of that will be on ESA.
Same for Germany. No updates from Eiichiiro. Paolo to send a reminder to ask for some details.
Sweden: see if calibration/testing is still an option. Or see if there is some other potential contribution.  Original proposal: Cryostat to test the entire optics tube. To test optical properties.  ESA is building a 4K facility for RF measurements. In October meeting attendees visit their facility.

3. Finnish proposal: Radek: not clear if this is a FInnish participation. It seems more a personal participation. They can be involved as individuals.  Ask whether there is a plan beyond the fate of the ERC to try to drag a national contribution, with cost contribution from some national institution. LUDO: Belgian people (CSL). Lot of facilities freely available fi the scientific community is involved. Ludo originally proposed to organize a meeting by september. Need to organize a meeting with them. A scientific meeting. Ludo has a list of people. 6 people interested.  The meeting will consist of a seminar to present the program, and discussion. 

4. No updated on Data Management. and JSG. IMO group very active during Summer.  On Maurizio’s role, Ludo agrees that is important to include Marizio is the activity management. Ludo to talk to Sophie V0 is delivered and Maurizio was not part of that. 

5. Public page on EU site

Draft from Italy:

Everyone to take a look. OK to upload on site, but password protected for now
To be completed and reviewed, also by JAXA